# https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PPnvle99vcQ # @AdamMorganIbbotson 2024-12-17 Unfortunately I cannot access the papers on the "Longsdale axe factory" from here. Wikipedia says that the "factory" produced only rough shapes, which were turned into polished axes elsewhere; yet it was the ultimate source of 27% of all axes found al over Great Britain. Presumably the stone from that location was particularly well suited for that use. Or maybe it was because of a self-sustained fame, like Rolex watches and Vuitton bags today: everybody "knows" that they are symbols of wealth, because everybody knows that they ware. @AdamMorganIbbotson 1 month ago Hey - my new book discusses this in detail! Highly recommend! @JorgeStolfi 1 month ago Your definition of "ritual" is too complicated, too narrow, and problematic. Are the American Fourth of July fireworks a ritual? What about Burning Man, or the World Soccer Cup? Or throwing coins in the Trevi fountain, or the changing of the guard at Buckingham? If Burning Man and the Soccer Cup are rituals, where is the religion? If they are not (because they lack religious significance, "inner meaning", whatever), then how can you tell whether any prehistoric site or artifact is "ritual"? That would require knowing what was in the head of the people who created it... I prefer the definition "a ritual is an action that is performed for its symbolic value rather than for its actual physical effects". Thus religious ceremonies would be rituals, and so would be putting flowers on tombs of deceased relatives, cutting the ribbon in the dedication of a building, carrying a rabbit's foot, giving a cup or medal to the winner of a competition, clicking beer glasses for a cheer. But Burning Man and the Soccer Cup would not be rituals, because they are done for the fun that they provide, not for any symbolic value. This definition still makes it hard to tell whether an ancient site or artifact was "ritual" (was Stonehenge temple, or just a fairgrounds for a Neolithic Burning Man?). But it makes that decision possible, at least in theory: depending on whether one can find evidence of a concrete benefit that people derived from it -- like entertainment, trade, boundary demarcation, calendar fixing -- or evidence for the absence of such benefit. @AdamMorganIbbotson 1 month ago Too complicated AND too narrow? Also, no soccer and fireworks are NOT rituals. There are other words for them (sport / celebrations). Ritual CAN be used metaphorically in those scenarios, but not in a literal sense. To make it too broad is to kill all meaning to the word. @JorgeStolfi 1 month ago @AdamMorganIbbotson Yes, I agree that soccer is not not a "ritual", because it is performed for its effects and not as a symbolic action. But how can one objectively tell the difference between "celebration" and "ritual"? That is why I feel that your definition is too narrow: it requires some sort of religiosity, which is at best a fuzzy concept, at worst an unscientific one because its presence cannot be objectively determined. By your definition, isn't your opening example (people doing things around the great leader house etc) just a "celebration"? What is the evidence that Stonehenge (or any other Neolithic monument) ever had any "ritual" aspect, as opposed to just "celebratory" or utilitarian? And I don't think that my definition is too broad. It does distinguish between the World Soccer Cup (not ritual) and cutting the ribbon at inauguration (ritual) and burying the dead (not ritual) and placing gifts in the tomb (ritual) and choosing a king (not ritual) and crowning him (ritual), etc. And I would say that "folkloric" dances performed by accountants and college students for tourists' consumption are still "ritual", because they are performed for being symbols of the country --even if the performers themselves don't care about them. And kneeling at Mass or setting up a Christmas tree are still rituals even if the person is an Atheist... @AdamMorganIbbotson 1 month ago @JorgeStolfi May be true, but all classic definitions of the word specify religion. Removing this from the word, essentially gets rid of a verbage word for religious rites. We use it elsewhere as a metaphore, and that's fine too!