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161  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: July 13, 2014, 04:44:47 PM
There was a +60 CNY sudden jump on the Chinese exchanges at about 2014-07-11 11:30 UTC, which is 19:30 China time.  It could have been someone hearing something about that (the Forbes post is dated 2014-07-12).
162  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: July 13, 2014, 04:37:35 PM
I believe that the Forbes blogpost author misses the point.  If you own a large amount of bitcoin, creating a bitcoin-backed investment fund (BBIF), like SMBIT, is an efficient way to sell those coins without depressing the price or looking like you lost faith in the Moon.

The idea is that instead of selling the bitcoins directly, you sell shares of the BBIF, which are pegged to the daily BTC market price.  Whenever some client buys some BBIF shares, the fund management company (FMC) is supposed to use his money to buy bitcoins.  If you are the FMC owner and manager, you just sell your own personal bitcoins (which you acquired for pennies years ago) to the FMC, at market price.

That way you can discreetly sell 20'000 BTC of yours in one go, at market price -- without the huge negative slippage you would face by selling on exchanges.  And the FMC gets to buy 20'000 BTC, to satisfy their contract with the BBIF client, at market price -- without the huge positive slippage (and hence loss) of buying them at the exchange.

Even if the bitcoin price crashes some day, the loss will fall entirely on the BBIF clients, since the BBIF shares will crash too; whereas the FMC and its shareholders will have still made a nice profit from the BBIF administration fees.

Indeed, if the FMC management can see a crash coming, they could make additional profit by selling the coins beforehand while the price is still high, and then liquidating the BBIF shares at the crash-bottom price.  Or vice-versa if they see a rally coming.  More generally, they could make additional profit, beyond the posted shares, by playing the market with the FMC coins (although that may be risky, and should be severely constrained by the BBIF contract).

The FMC could also use its coins to manipulate the market (given its minuscule liquidity) to inflate the price while selling the BBIF shares, and lowering it when some BBIF client decides to liquidate.  But, of course, no bitcoin entrepreneur would resort to such sleazy banker tricks in order to make money.

163  Bitcoin / Legal / Re: BFL (Butterfly Labs) Monarch Very Late. ||Attention: Lawyers & Monarch Customers on: July 13, 2014, 03:23:09 PM
Ugh. You mean you intend to robot-spam all kind of sites, bypassing their captchas and such?  You want to annoy a dirty scumbag who stole money from 20'000 people by wasting the time of millions of readers and administrators who have nothing to do with that?

You lost me there.  I hope the law gets to you somehow, as well as to the BFL scumbags.  Bye.


164  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: July 13, 2014, 03:11:54 PM
http://www.technews.org/active-stock-facebook-inc-nasdaqfb-to-enter-digital-payment-world/2910133/

What part of "trustless" do they not understand? Irelands central bank getting behind a propitiatory system, Brazils doing the same but on a different and likely incompatible platform, wonder who's next? Popcorn at the ready because they could all end up destroying themselves in a fight to monopolise digital money with platforms that simply cant compete with free Smiley
I owe you to check on that Brazilian thing.  (It may be just about "digital money", such as debit cards and boletos. When the BCB issued the standard warning to the people about the risks of cryptocurrrencies, they had to add a paragraph clarifying that cryptocurrencies were NOT "digital money"in the sense of Article NNN of Law XXX.)

But I can tell you already that Caixa Econômica is not just a Brazilian bank; it is the only remaining retail bank majoritarily owned by the federal government.  The federal government appoints its CEO, and uses it for its social assistance programs, like the Family Grant program and financing of low-cost housing.  It could not get any worse for Libertarians, I guess.  Grin
165  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: July 13, 2014, 03:02:11 PM
More importantly, Gox only has about $7 mil left in cash and a lot of people will claim cash over Bitcoins. That means there could be another large liquidation down the road.
It is my understanding that all bitcoins will be converted to cash by auction, and all the claimants will receive reimbursements in Yen, no matter what their claim is.  That is the usual liquidation rule in Japan as well as in the US, it seems.  (However MtGOX is a rather unusual bankruptcy, and perhaps they will treat it differently.) 
166  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: July 13, 2014, 02:57:32 PM
I'm surprised no one is talking about the Gox creditor meeting on the 23rd as being a possible catalyst. Especially when the fate of 200,000 Bitcoins lies in the balance...
I think that read somewhere that Mark managed to convince the liquidators that a certain amount of the bitcoins in question were not owned by MtGOX but by the parent company Tibanne, so they should not be included in the MtGOX liquidation.  Did I only dream of it?
167  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Dollar-Backed Digital Currency Aims to Fix Bitcoin’s Volatility Dilemma on: July 13, 2014, 02:08:49 PM
[ Anecdote of Xerox PARC staff laughing at Macintosh in 1985 for its flaws compared to Xerox Star workstations ]
So, perhaps it is not yet the time to laugh at RealCoin just because it is technically garbage.

Or laugh louder so that we draw attention to the fact that it's technically garbage.  Perhaps if the internet had been a thing in 1980, the word would have spread more easily that the mac was the inferior product and Xerox wouldn't have been relegated to photocopiers, printers and fax machines.  If there's a marketing battle to be won, then we should point out the flaws in our competition where we see them.  And realcoin is definitely flawed.
I failed to get the point across, sorry.  The comparison with Apple x Xerox only goes so far.

(Actually Xerox was much bigger than Apple at that time, they had the largest marketing firepower, and they were experts on networking.  (The Ethernet LAN had been invented there, they created the first internet-wide forum, and my boss's boss Bob Taylor at the time had been the director of DARPA in the 1970s when DARPA invented the internet.) And the Xerox workstations were better than the first Macintosh in many respects.  But the Mac was 1/20 of the price, and had Jobs and Wozniak.)

My point is that Brock Pierce is not the typical bitcoin enthusiast or bitcoin entrepreneur or even bitcoin VC investor.  He not only has experience in playing the industry takeover game, but is the kind of guy who changes the rules of the game to suit him.  The mere fact that he bought his way from being an unknown outsider with no businesses in bitcoinland to the helm of the Bitcoin Foundation in a few months should get people on alert.
168  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Very severe blow to bitcoin on: July 13, 2014, 01:42:46 PM
Taaki goes on to describe the bitcoin anarchist’s elusive ideal: decentralized, autonomous corporations whose equity is tracked in the bitcoin blockchain rather than in legal contracts and whose funds are held at a bitcoin address controlled in part by every stakeholder. [ ... ] In that future, math and consensus, not violence, might govern the control of resources. The result, as Taaki describes it, would be a new society where code replaces courts and men with guns as the arbiter of civilization. “We have new tools, a new class of mathematical contracts, based on the incorruptible rules of the cosmos,” he says, his voice resonating through the empty building.
I am trying to imagine armed robbers breaking into Taaki's home to steal his car and valuable trinkets, pointing their guns at the blockchain, and leaving frustrated because it won't transfer his property to their address.

By the way, wasn't Taaki involved with Intersango?
169  Other / Off-topic / Klee on: July 13, 2014, 09:40:17 AM
Following the Scammer's Manual to the letter: "Once the victim begins to doubt that he will ever get his money back, offer to return part of it; he will be so happy that he will let you walk away free with the rest."
In this case, what's the incentive to return any at all? Its virtually inconceivable that they could get the bitcoin back without the hacker's cooperation, or even track it to an IP, let alone an individual.
Just psychology. A bitcoin thief runs a non-negligible risk of being caught by a bounty-hunting hacker, or denounced by a friend.  But if the victim gets part of loot back, he will cancel the bounty and almost always give up on the chase.

At this point, for example, if the MtGOX victims were to get 20% of their coins back, they would probably "turn the page" on the incident and stop harassing Mark and his partners.
170  Other / Off-topic / Klee on: July 13, 2014, 09:24:29 AM
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=686275.msg7816540#msg7816540
Thanks again everyone for their interest and help!
Following the Scammer's Manual to the letter: "Once the victim begins to doubt that he will ever get his money back, offer to return part of it; he will be so happy that he will let you walk away free with the rest."
That was my intention with the 500btc bounty - I am quite sure I would never see them back, at least not before 3 years..
Well then, if you are glad that you lost 700 BTC, I am glad for you too.  Wink

And there goes another successful bitcoin entrepreneur, who has found a way to earn hundreds of BTC from a single "customer", with little work and without any legal risk.  May his career be long and prosper.

 Tongue
171  Other / Off-topic / Klee on: July 13, 2014, 08:58:16 AM
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=686275.msg7816540#msg7816540
Thanks again everyone for their interest and help!
Following the Scammer's Manual to the letter: "Once the victim begins to doubt that he will ever get his money back, offer to return part of it; he will be so happy that he will let you walk away free with the rest."
172  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Very severe blow to bitcoin on: July 13, 2014, 08:48:41 AM
In any event, Gavin's criticism was lack of transparency, not that the organization is centralized.
It was Andreas who said that. Gavin apparently disputed his claim.
173  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Very severe blow to bitcoin on: July 13, 2014, 08:45:06 AM
Economical, the BF has not much saying anyway, comparing it to a king in a kingdom is a faulty comparison. The BF is more a coordinator than a king.

A protocol can work very well decentralized. But an organization can't work decentralized in an efficient manner. Sure bitcoin can also develop if everyone does their own thing, but it will take longer.

Lets assume the Bitcoin Foundation members decided to hire an additional developper and then had to vote for the right person.  In fact Gavin Anderson would have to work with that person the most. So wouldn't it be right that he can choose the person?

Reather than letting hundrets of people around the world voting for someone that they might not even know?

Democracy is good, but it has disadvantages and decentralization has it's limits.
If the mission of the BF was limited to maintaining the software and coordinating protocol changes, a closed management might be justifiable.  

However, the BF was created with the goal of keeping its founders in control of the Bitcoin "industry", e.g. by endorsing or blacklisting exchanges and other bitcoin ventures, by being the obvious representatives of the community for the media and in negotiations with the government, by running and being keynote speakers at bitcoin conferences, and so on.  Wanting to do that with a closed-club structure is totally evil, no matter what one thinks of bitcoin.  

The BF has in the past endorsed MtGOX, and given the 1984 treatment to bitcoiners who would not cooperate with the club, like Mircea Popescu and the Chinese exchange owners other than Bobby Lee.

If someone decided to corner the Bitcoin "industry" for his own profit, he should begin by buying his way into the top ranks of the BF.  Then he could even create his own centralized altcoin to compete with bitcoin, and the BF would not even whisper a "but-but-but...".



174  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: BFL fucks us over again on: July 13, 2014, 08:20:13 AM
Cheesy
175  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: July 13, 2014, 07:45:31 AM
Perhaps he got too close with the Brock Pierce investigation!
Could be... he started poking into the dirty doings of some big shots like Pierce, then of some really big shots (of the kind that employs a dozen lawyer full-time), then of some really, really big shots (of the kind that appoints Supreme Court judges) ...  He may well have received a letter from a lawyer firm with a dozen names in its name.  He does not seem to be rich enough to afford a legal battle over that.

But, just before he left, he also had painted himself into an awkward corner over an old claim that he once lost over 1000 BTC in the InstaWallet "hack". He had been demanding refund from the InstaWallet ex-owner, but the ex-owner claims that there is no record of those BTC deposits in their database or the blockchain. (But, on the other hand, it seems quite possible that their search procedure was inadequate.) The InstaWallet ex-owner is an admin of this forum, by the way.  Phinneas offered a bounty for the return of even a small part of his BTC, but it was phrased in such a way that the thief could just give him that small part, minus the bounty, and walk away free with the rest: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=649176.0.
 
But also someone claimed that Phinneas owed him a refund for a used mining machine that he sold through an Internet auction and was damaged on arrival: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=667460.0.

And his last log-in is exactly three years and 1 day after his first one. Perhaps he realized that, and thought that it was a good time to quit the habit.  Wink
176  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: BFL fucks us over again on: July 13, 2014, 07:01:30 AM
I thought of a new way to make money with bitcoin.  Design a mining machine with state-of-the-art ASIC chips, get pre-order money from thousands of customers, build thousands of units with that money, run them for a few months (with centralized PSU and cooling) in order to test them, keep all the bitcoins that they mine during that test, and when the rising difficulty makes them uneconomical, ship them to the customers (with bogus FCC/CE stickers and some cheap PSUs) to make space for the next generation. 

Do you think this idea could work?
177  Other / Off-topic / Re: Answer the question above with a question. on: July 13, 2014, 05:59:27 AM
My head is beginning to hurt; do you wonder why?
Do you remember the first time you ever asked "Why" about anything?
Like, "Why do people say 'Y' to ask why?"?
Actually I remember the day I asked 'why' about something, it was almost exactly 50 years ago, in my high school English class, the same day I asked the teacher, what is the difference between 'how' and 'why'?
178  Other / Off-topic / Re: Answer the question above with a question. on: July 13, 2014, 05:55:53 AM
My head is beginning to hurt; do you wonder why?
Do you remember the first time you ever asked "Why" about anything?
Like, "Why do people say 'Y' to ask why?"?
179  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: July 13, 2014, 05:51:50 AM
I hear some people are looking to go back to the moon Grin Grin Grin
I read hundreds if not thousands of posts about that around 1990 in the old sci.space forum. People were confident that in a couple of years one could launch and assemble a self-sufficient Moon base, distilling oxygen from rocks with solar power and mining helium-3 for export, if only the politicians saw the light.

But those plans were technically unfeasible at the time, of course. How could one go to the Moon without Bitcoin? Grin
180  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: July 13, 2014, 05:38:50 AM
if you don't mind sweaty fat men in tutus.
Speaking of which, @Phinnaeus_Gage, the most prolific poster on this forum by far, has been absent since 2014-06-17.  https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=24792  
People who miss him or not have been speculating https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=667460.0
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