|
562
|
Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion
|
on: June 23, 2014, 01:35:05 AM
|
|
Monday 09:30 am in China, and Huobi has as little volume as it had at 03:00 am, or less. Ditto for OKCoin.
AFAIK it is not a holiday in China.
If it was only one of them I could guess that its trading API was being DDOSed. But since it is both, perhaps they all turned off their trade API, so that little that we see is the manual trade, without any robots.
Guessing far out into space: perhaps the surge of accusations about insider trading and leverage abuse at Bitfinex, over this weekend, scared them.
|
|
|
|
|
565
|
Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion
|
on: June 22, 2014, 11:42:48 PM
|
There is a new note on OKcoin announcing new bitcoin services. I cannot make much sense of it, but someone may find it relevant perhaps: Through Google Translate: Posted :2014-06-21 00:47:17 - IP:. 114.249 * *.
OKCoin launch leveraged and "raw coins currency union Money"
Dear little friends,
40 days after the closing lever in peer leadership, based on strong industry development trend and requirements of the user, OKCoin made a difficult decision: to launch leveraged and "raw coins coins" financial products.
About "leverage"
Leveraged trading is an integral part of the financial market, financial instruments that establish user-friendly and flexible positions, under the premise of strict risk control, to provide the possibility to achieve greater profits; Users can make use of the borrowed currency leverage to their own judgments increase support.
OKCoin introduced still maintaining the highest leveraged transaction does not exceed three times the original lever, a professional risk management mechanisms to protect the assets of the security of the user. Hong Kong OKCoin (HK) Company Limited provide leveraged lending business and virtual assets in cash, and is responsible for product operations and risk management, OKCoin trading platform provides information dissemination and system support.
On "raw coins coins"
"Health coins coins" financial products in Hong Kong OKCoin Bitcoin users to tailor the latest financial products virtual assets, mainly loans and other invested assets investment for the virtual channels. "Health coins coins" financial products contain "raw coins currency union Money" and "raw coins currency financial accounts," two varieties.
"Health coins currency union financial" products for all Bitcoin users, users only need to deposit coins OKCoin can share product revenue; "raw coins currency financial accounts" product form and "raw coins currency union financial management" similar gains independence accounting, risk. According to laws and regulations, "Health and coins currency financial accounts" products are currently only allowed to have signed a written trust agreement user participation. Hong Kong OKCoin Co. Ltd management and income distribution operators responsible for product, OKCoin trading platform provides subscription channels and system support services.
Product Features
1, A safe and efficient small partners need only OKCoin trading platform can be directly leveraged transactions and financial experience OKCoin always safe and stable professional services.
2, a small partner can choose a variety of options to subscribe for product revenue sharing joint financial products, you can also select "financial accounts"
3, higher income OKCoin maintain a consistent profit to the user's habits, only 20% of the management fees collected from users, resulting 80%.
You read that right! OKCoin of P2P currency financing melting plastic back, we continue to lay coins and other coins raw bar.
|
|
|
|
|
568
|
Economy / Economics / Re: Reliable data on increasing adoption?
|
on: June 22, 2014, 11:04:13 PM
|
To get an idea about the current focus if this forum, I collected and analyzed three screenfuls of the "recent posts" page, taken several hours ago, spaced several minutes apart (so that there was no intersection). I classified by hand the 120 posts into the six categories below:
Posts ! % ! Category
------+------+--------------------------------
8 | 6.7 | Off-topic
4 | 3.3 | Gambling
18 | 15.0 | Bitcoin mining
18 | 15.0 | Bitcoin non-Mining, non-Chinese
19 | 15.8 | Bitcoin non-Mining, Chinese
53 | 44.2 | Altcoins (including mining)
So, modulo the limitations of this small particular sample, it would seem that the forum posts are now evenly split betwen Bitcoin and altcoins (~45% each). Apart from mining, the Bitcoin-related posts are evenly split between Chinese-language posts and non-Chinese (mostly English). [ Data file ] |
|
|
|
|
569
|
Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion
|
on: June 22, 2014, 10:17:05 PM
|
I presume someone could buy 25k if one uses at least 3 exchanges (Bitstamp, daily volume 4000 BTC; Bitfinex, daily volume 4800 BTC; btc-e, daily volume 3000 BTC souirce: http://bitcoincharts.com/markets/). If you were to use just 10% of total volume daily (12800 BTC), which means 1280 BTC bought per day, would mean that you need 20 days to accomplish your goal without moving the market that much. And during that time the price could go up up up. Arbitrage effectively connects all the exchanges into a single global market; with some shifts in the prices, from which the arbitragers make their profit, and a delay of a minute or less. So by trading on any of those exchanges you are trading on all of them, and also on all the Chinese exchanges. Together they can easily absorb 1300 BTC per day, I woudl think; but if done repeatedly over 20 days the price will probably move quite a bit. It seems advisable in general to split a large buy (or sell) into several smaller buys spaced a few minutes apart, so that the arbitragers have a chance to bring the asks or bids) from other exchanges into the one where you are trading. Trading drectly on two or more exchanges should only save the arbitrage fees. |
|
|
|
|
570
|
Economy / Service Discussion / Re: And we have another Bitfinex Hookey THIEVING Short Squeeze!
|
on: June 22, 2014, 09:29:36 PM
|
I wouldn't trust BitcoinWisdom's ticker, I recall seeing glitches there before. It would be easy enough to prove/disprove this with another source. I'll try and see if I can get a ticker chart elsewhere.
I have noticed trades out of chronological order in the bitcoinwisdom trade log for Bitstamp. Bitcoinwisdom 's owner explained that it is not his bug, those glitches are in the data returned by Bitstamp's chart API. I understood that it has to do with clock skew between the Bitstamp machines that process trades via trading API and manual trades. I did not detect any such glitches on several Huobi log samples that I collected. I have not checked Bitfinex logs. |
|
|
|
|
571
|
Other / Alternate cryptocurrencies / Re: rpietila Altcoin Observer
|
on: June 22, 2014, 04:42:16 AM
|
Of course you don't really LIKE the idea of Monero do you Jorge?  Is it bad to keep our money where there is no way for government to see? My opinion is irrelevant. You should worry about what your government thinks of it. |
|
|
|
|
572
|
Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion
|
on: June 21, 2014, 11:37:06 PM
|
The USMS is a public entity. I hardly see how they could keep the result secret.
That is what it says in their auction announcement FAQ. I suppose that they consider it private information about the bidders. But they give instructions on how to submit FOIA request in the folowing line, although it is not clear whether that will allow the results to be disclosed. By the way, I must correct an earlier post of mine: the same person CAN submit two or more bids at different prices, using separate bid forms. |
|
|
|
|
573
|
Economy / Economics / Re: How profitable are exchanges?
|
on: June 21, 2014, 09:58:38 PM
|
PS. I must point out that I am not a trader, so figuring out ways in which exchange owners could cheat on their clients is merely a curious puzzle for me. Exchange owners have much stronger motivations, so they surely will find much "better "solutions to that puzzle. One way to find such solutions in to read the laws and SEC regulations that apply to the operation of ordinary stock exchanges. Every practice that is prohibited by them must be a proven way to unfairly take money from customers; so one can bet that the bitcoin exchange owners are doing it.  |
|
|
|
|
574
|
Economy / Economics / Re: Would u pay in bitcoin?
|
on: June 21, 2014, 09:49:47 PM
|
They chose paypal.
So, the inconvenience (and expense - might have cost them $7 in exchange fees) of acquiring the bitcoin was not worth $40 to this buyer. A tech-savvy buyer, based in San Francisco.
It's anecdotal, but I think THIS is exactly what bitcoin needs to overcome to hit mainstream use. It's got to be easier for consumers to acquire/pay using bitcoin. The incentive has to outweigh the perceived hassle.
Indeed. I suppose he would pay for the coins at the exchange with Paypal or with his credit card, so one should add the fees for that to the $7. And then there may be a delay before the money is available for trading. And another delay for moving the coins from the exchange to BitPay or to you. Volatility is another big obstacle. If you post the bitcoin price as a fixed amount of BTC, you run the risk of the USD/BTC rate going down, in which case you would lose money. (Last Friday it dropped 8% in a couple of hours, for example.) A smart customer or competitor may wait for the rate to drop, and then buy lots of merchandise from you at below-market price. Conversely, the customer runs the risk of the rate going up while he is buying the bitcoins. To guard aganst that possibility, he has to send perhaps 5-10% more money to the exchange than he would need at the current rate. If the rate does go up that much, he will end up paying more via bitcoin than via Paypal. If the rate does not go ub by that much, or goes down, he will be left with a few extra dollars at the exchange, or a few extra BTC; which he must retrieve and spend elsewhere, otherwise he would lose money all the same. If you post the bitcoin price as "the BTC equivalent of 360$", you merely push some(but not all) of your risk to the client. I gather that Coinbase and Paypal have some mechanisms to alleviate some of these risks and hassles. I don't know the details, but even if they offer a fixed USD/BTC rate for the day, it only reduces the volatility risks, it does not eliminate it. At this point, bitcoin payments options are advantageous only for people who already own a pile of BTC and want to cash on some of it to buy stuff. Those options let them skip a couple of steps in that process. |
|
|
|
|
576
|
Other / Off-topic / Re: Answer the question above with a question.
|
on: June 21, 2014, 08:02:12 PM
|
but dont you guys find tor extremely slow though?
What does TOR have to do with the previous question? yes, could @sifter please answer that question? (is it clear to everybody which question I meant by "that question"?) |
|
|
|
|
579
|
Economy / Economics / Re: How profitable are exchanges?
|
on: June 21, 2014, 07:19:59 PM
|
Insider arbitrage is fine in my book. They are providing liquidity and market participants are benefiting by having their order filled at limit price.
Any money that the arbitrager makes comes out of other clients' pockets. So if the exchange owners do arbitrage and collude to peek at each other's books before other clients, they are taking unfair advantage of them. An arbitrager essentially merges the order book of some other exchange A into the exchange B where you are trading. However, while doing so, he raises some of the asks and lowers some of the bids; in such a way that, when you trade into those "transported" orders, you pay more or earn less than you would if you were trading on exchange A. These differences are pocketed by the arbitrager. The cost of moving money from one exchange to another exchange isn't free nor cheap nor convenient.
Arbitrage does not require moving national money across exchanges. If one has suitable reserves or money and coins on each exchange, one can keep all four accounts balanced (and steadily increasing) by moving bitcoins only between the exchanges and adjusting the amounts bought and sold on each side. Moreover, such rebalancing is necessary only if the traders are grossly unbalanced, e.g. if the price is steadily rising and one exchange is consistently behind the other. If the price is going up and down at random, one expects that the accounts will tend to stay nearly balanced just by statistical cancellation. |
|
|
|
|
580
|
Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion
|
on: June 21, 2014, 07:02:51 PM
|
Anyone have an ideas on why bitcoin is so polarizing? Either you love it or you hate it, not many are in between.
Well, either it will "go to the Moon" (i.e. its price will get much higher than now, and keep rising at least 5-10% 500-1000% per year) or it will collapse to 0. There is no viable long-term scenario between those two. So, one's attitude towards bitcoin depends on which scenario one believes in. fixed that for you  I wrote "at least" Of course there is somewhere between the two extremes.
I think that Erik Vorhees himself said that bitcoin was an all-or-nothing thing to Bloomberg; I recall that from a video on YouTube. The argument being, I suppose, that if the price (purchasing power, more precisely) stops increasing, or the increase slows down to less than 5-10% per year, investors will dump their bitcoin holdings to invest in more profitable items, like stock or real estate. Then there will be massive devaluation and volatility, etc., and eventually loss of utility as a payment medium. Since it pays no dividends and has no backing assets, an ever-increasing purchasing power is necessary to keep bitcoin attractive to long-term investors. |
|
|
|
|
Show Posts
